Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

A forum to seperate the more serious discussions from the lighter topics in Off-topic.

I agree that these are immoral

Porn - immoral
11
9%
Smoking - immoral
10
9%
Obesity - immoral
6
5%
Gambling - immoral
8
7%
Drunkenness - immoral
12
10%
Breaking a promise - immoral
33
28%
Losing your patience - immoral
6
5%
Holding a grudge - immoral
12
10%
Not keeping the Sabbath holy - immoral
10
9%
Sex before marriage - immoral
9
8%
 
Total votes : 117

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby Kian » 29 Nov 2011, 15:27

I hope my earlier posts make clear that my own position on morals pretty much completely reflects the stance taken above by Beo*.

When explaining this sort of position face to face I have noticed that often, people with a moral 'code' dictated by an outside force, such as a religion, have a kneejerk response that my position is a cop out.

That it basically gives me a carte blanche to "do whatever you like".

It is not difficult, however, to quickly get them to agree that it is anything but a cop out.

By taking my particular stance of the morals of any given action being subject to the circumstances and environment of when, how and why the action is being performed, I am giving myself a very hard time indeed.

It means that I must make a moral judgment on each and every act that I perform, witness or become aware of.

No lists, no laws, no guidance other than what I have learned from everything I have experienced in living this life for fifty one years .

Far from a cop out, it's hard work, believe me, and I know I will never get it right all of the time.

People who live their life in strict and unbending compliance with any of the proposed 'list' of morals I have ever come across are, to me, in grave danger of performing grossly immoral acts from my perspective.

We all surely cannot abrogate responsibility for our actions simply by blindly following any set of orders laid down for us, whatever their source.

For once, it really is all situational.

*Except for a massive fit of jealousy... what kind of shoes do I have to walk a mile in before I get to perform 'altruistic adultery'??????
"Tell the truth, and so puzzle and confound your adversaries. ” Sir Henry Wotton

"I'm better pleas'd to make one more,
Than be the death o' twenty." Lines on War - Rabbie Burns
User avatar
Kian
 
Posts: 2710
Joined: 30 Dec 2008, 01:52
Location: UK
Class: Diplomat
All-game rating: (1000)
Timezone: GMT

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby beowulf7 » 29 Nov 2011, 16:26

:D
User avatar
beowulf7
 
Posts: 2431
Joined: 07 Jan 2009, 17:55
Location: Kent, UK
Class: Diplomat
Standard rating: (938)
All-game rating: (946)
Timezone: GMT

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby steelfish » 30 Nov 2011, 22:01

Kian wrote:I hope my earlier posts make clear that my own position on morals pretty much completely reflects the stance taken above by Beo*.

When explaining this sort of position face to face I have noticed that often, people with a moral 'code' dictated by an outside force, such as a religion, have a kneejerk response that my position is a cop out.

That it basically gives me a carte blanche to "do whatever you like".

It is not difficult, however, to quickly get them to agree that it is anything but a cop out.

By taking my particular stance of the morals of any given action being subject to the circumstances and environment of when, how and why the action is being performed, I am giving myself a very hard time indeed.

It means that I must make a moral judgment on each and every act that I perform, witness or become aware of.

No lists, no laws, no guidance other than what I have learned from everything I have experienced in living this life for fifty one years .

Far from a cop out, it's hard work, believe me, and I know I will never get it right all of the time.

People who live their life in strict and unbending compliance with any of the proposed 'list' of morals I have ever come across are, to me, in grave danger of performing grossly immoral acts from my perspective.

We all surely cannot abrogate responsibility for our actions simply by blindly following any set of orders laid down for us, whatever their source.

For once, it really is all situational.


Sorry to disappoint you Kian but the kind of morality that you espouse is a morality that requires the ability to think and decide for oneself. Some people are unable or unwilling to do so therefore they abdicate that responsibility by letting others do the hard work of deciding what is moral and what is not moral. Some will claim to follow a divinely created morality. That way they are absolved of any responsibility of making moral decisions. And yet they will claim that their morality is superior because it has been divinely crafted and given to them.
History has shown that people who claim a divinely crafted morality are quite willing to do atrocious things in the name of their divinity.
steelfish
 
Posts: 776
Joined: 09 Mar 2011, 05:39
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (1097)
All-game rating: (1099)
Timezone: GMT-5

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby Chrome » 28 Sep 2020, 18:55

"Either there is morality or it is not."
who said that it should be the same and monolithic? there are as many types of morality as there are groups of people, of course, there is a certain similarity between these different types of morality, but there are also many differences (sometimes small, sometimes significant)
there were attempts to impose a single morality on everyone, for example, Christians or Muslims, but nobody really succeeded
although why breed such a deep philosophy out of the blue
for me the moral is to be HUMAN, not to offend the weak, to be honest with yourself and with others, everything is simple!
Oh, will we ever be set free?
User avatar
Chrome
 
Posts: 19
Joined: 09 Sep 2020, 13:40
Location: Manchester

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby TheCraw » 24 Mar 2021, 03:02

Image
Very clever, Mr. Smart...
User avatar
TheCraw
Premium Member
 
Posts: 17275
Joined: 05 Dec 2008, 23:39
Location: lurking, baby.... lurking.
Class: Shropshire slasher
All-game rating: 1,000,000
Timezone: GMT-5

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby schocker » 24 Mar 2021, 15:56

Breaking a promise .....immoral
Member of The Classicists
schocker
Premium Member
 
Posts: 557
Joined: 12 Jun 2010, 19:05
Location: Katy. Texas
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: 1398
All-game rating: 1395
Timezone: GMT-6

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby The O » 25 Mar 2021, 18:16

schocker wrote:Breaking a promise .....immoral


In all cases? You can't imagine a scenario where it would be "moral" to break a promise?
User avatar
The O
 
Posts: 2442
Joined: 06 Dec 2008, 01:52
Location: Chicago
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (953)
All-game rating: (885)
Timezone: GMT-6

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby musashisamurai » 09 Apr 2021, 03:10

The O wrote:
schocker wrote:Breaking a promise .....immoral


In all cases? You can't imagine a scenario where it would be "moral" to break a promise?


I suppose you can envision a scenario (easily) where breaking the promise might be immoral, but the action that breaks isn't. But I agree with what you are implying, that thats a narrow-minded view of ethics and morality.

As a simple example that can be widely applicable, lets say a coworker of mine at work tells me they are doing some unethical, immoral, or against the law and they promise me not to tell anyone. I think I have a higher obligation to alert others than I do to my coworker, depending on what the crime is. There's also issues of mental illness-as an RA, when I was college, I made it clear to my residents that I was resource there for them always, but that there were/are certain things I would need to share with my supervisor so we (she, the resident, and myself) could get better support for the person in question. If a resident told me they were depressed or suffering from anxiety, and I did not alert a relevant person OR help them to alert something for help, and there was a future tragedy, I'd argue pretty easily that I was at fault. In this circumstance, 'keeping the promise" to be silent is unethical. (Which is why I did not put myself in the position of making such promises)
¸,,¸_____}\,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,...,,,,,,
`’’´¯¯¯¯¯}/’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’’¨¨¨¯
The simulacrum is never that which conceals the truth-it is the truth which conceals that there is none. The simulacrum is true.
musashisamurai
 
Posts: 16517
Joined: 16 Dec 2010, 21:54
Location: Galactic Sector ZZ9 Plural Z Alpha
Class: Diplomat
All-game rating: (1000)
Timezone: GMT-5

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby schocker » 09 Apr 2021, 14:20

OK, there are exceptions....but generally, if make a promise keep it or don't make a promise.
Member of The Classicists
schocker
Premium Member
 
Posts: 557
Joined: 12 Jun 2010, 19:05
Location: Katy. Texas
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: 1398
All-game rating: 1395
Timezone: GMT-6

Re: Working on a Sunday to keep me in beer and bets

Postby The O » 09 Apr 2021, 22:09

Wait.. so if there are exceptions, then you would agree that morality is situational. That was the point that I was trying to make.
User avatar
The O
 
Posts: 2442
Joined: 06 Dec 2008, 01:52
Location: Chicago
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (953)
All-game rating: (885)
Timezone: GMT-6

Previous

Return to Debates

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests