Mafia CLVI: Charity Mafia: -- Pure of Heart Win!

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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:05

Happymeal wrote:
Keirador wrote:Apropos of nothing, if you can't appreciate early Joanna Newsom because of how awful her voice is, I honestly feel like you're missing out. She is powering me through this read. In any fair world she would be our Poet Laureate.

Peach Plum Pear, Sadie, Emily, Monkey & Bear. Start there friends. And yes, her voice is the worst, but her harp is the best. And her lyrics are award-worthy.



Joanna Newsom is average at best. She has a huge following which is no surprise (a lot of people like to look cool) and is critically acclaimed, but it's not that her vocals are necessarily bad, but everything she does is not good. From lyricism to instrumentation to singing. Nothing I can particularly find appealing.

And Isaac Brock is greatest lyricist to have ever lived. Case closed.


Huh. I'm a huge Isaac Brock fan, but he doesn't even claim to be a particularly adroit lyricist. Is there a specific song you'd submit as evidence of his lyrical genius? Personally I'd submit Cowboy Dan, but that's largely a function of its raw truthful emotionalism, not a particular penchant for poetry.

As for Joanna Newsom, I'd inquire what you mean when you say she is "average at best." As a singer, she is not average, she is absolutely terrible. As far as instrumentation, I can only assume you literally do not know what you're talking about. Can you name a superior harpist? Lyrics are a subjective matter, but I would ask you to read the lyrics to Emily or Monkey & Bear without the distraction of her terrible voice. I think she's an superb lyricist.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby justy » 10 Dec 2016, 09:06

On phone so I make this quick.

@SJG: I honestly didn't even realize I should point it out that my town read on you isn't strong. I see D1 reads in general quite random. Most of the roster I think I can't read one way or a another. So when I said I town read you, I basically meant that I have had meaningful interaction with you and I think you've proposed town positive plan that you probably wouldn't as scum. So for example, if I should target my town read tonight in Harb's plan, you'd be one possibility.

@Keir So you think it's likely we don't have vig? I never thought it would be likely. Probably because everyone was talking about vig. I'm interested to hear what others have to say about your opinion that nine player game would be unbalanced with vig in it. I don't have experience enough of power role games to evaluate that.

I'm OK with the idea of Vig revealing. If there's not one, we can discard SJG's plan. If there's vig, we should go with SJG' plan.

@Thyrfing: You had good point about scum suggesting town positive plans they know a walkaround for. But I still think good plan should award town points. Not oodles of them, but some at least. I don't think there are that many ways to gain oodles of town points D1 and reads should be based on what little we have.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:11

YO VIG WHO YOU IS?
Does anyone have an objection to vig revealing?
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Happymeal » 10 Dec 2016, 09:18

Keirador wrote:
Huh. I'm a huge Isaac Brock fan, but he doesn't even claim to be a particularly adroit lyricist. Is there a specific song you'd submit as evidence of his lyrical genius? Personally I'd submit Cowboy Dan, but that's largely a function of its raw truthful emotionalism, not a particular penchant for poetry.

As for Joanna Newsom, I'd inquire what you mean when you say she is "average at best." As a singer, she is not average, she is absolutely terrible. As far as instrumentation, I can only assume you literally do not know what you're talking about. Can you name a superior harpist? Lyrics are a subjective matter, but I would ask you to read the lyrics to Emily or Monkey & Bear without the distraction of her terrible voice. I think she's an superb lyricist.


When it comes to music in general, I tend to lay down my qualifications of good in this manner:

for lyricism, what matters most is the execution of voice alongside the lyricism. How much conviction does the singer seem to have for what they say and how what they say is executed. Isaac brock is a very clever lyricist. I don't expect him to churn out a 1984, Moby Dick, Great Gatsby, or whatever, but that's not how, in my opinion, music functions. perhaps one can easily separate the lyrics from song and then say it's genius, but I believe music is an expression of everything sound and therefore the way the lyrics feel when sung is just as important as the lyrics themselves.

That's why I find Everclear's 90's discography to be particularly brilliant. Art isn't a particularly genius lyricist, but he executes his lyrics in such a way that I can feel he truly went through what he says. I mean, he did, some of it's exaggeration, some of it isn't, but voice is just as important to the words as the words are to the voice.

As for instrumentation, it's all about execution. How it intertwines with itself and how it intertwines with the vocals and lyrics. I don't think it's clear cut how any of this can be perfect, but these are generally the way I view music.

I mean, that's why I don't particularly like hair metal or . Some of those guys' guitar work is genius, but it's not about the single instruments being played. I do listen to instrumentals a lot, specifically progressive metal bands like Scale the summit or CHON. I've also listened to a lot of different japanese instrumental bands as well as post rock or math rock groups that venture into that foray or whatever. Minilism and classical is also a genre I tend to explore and so is jazz. I love a lot of jazz especially free jazz, European free jazz in particular. A lot of that I find to be great, but I can't just be hearing brilliant work, it needs to be structured in a fashion that makes me possess certain emotional responses to it. It just can't be good, but it needs to force a response.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:20

condude1 wrote:
sjg11 wrote:
Or am I misunderstanding something? What does buffing mean?


Probably something to do with making other roles more powerful. A debuff would be a framer, so I assume the corresponding buff would be a role that makes the cop infallible, or something?

Order of Resolution
Night actions will be fulfilled in the following order to the extent they are in the game:
Other
Redirecting/Blocking
Deceiving/Clarifying
Protecting
Buff/Debuff
Investigative
Killing

You are not correct about your assumptions here. I will not elaborate further.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Happymeal » 10 Dec 2016, 09:26

As much as I love LCD and everything on it, there are few songs in general I find that possess the optimal qualities when it comes to music. I like a lot of music, but these are the songs that I can safely say represent perfection in the art:

"Last stop: This town" - Eels
"Third planet" and "Dramamine" - Modest Mouse
"Car" - Built to Spill
"Seven" - Sunny Day Real Estate
"Here's your future" - The Thermals
"New Mistake" - Jellyfish
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Happymeal » 10 Dec 2016, 09:29

*LCW
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:30

@Happymeal: I remember this now! You're a troll! We've been over this in the Debates and Off-Topics forums, and you torture definitions of things so that you're always right if we accept your narrow, unpopular definitions of terms.

We're good. Carry on.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:34

But gotdamn if Third Planet isn't truly transcendent art. Uniting warring camps.
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Re: Charity Mafia: Day 1

Postby Keirador » 10 Dec 2016, 09:37

Happymeal, if you meant for me to start listening to The Moon & Antarctica and become emotionally paralyzed, you've succeeded.
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