A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Aeschines » 04 Jul 2019, 21:53

Durga wrote:Why are the two people I throw shade on for being scum both voting me? Smh


Your entire analysis for why I was scum can be summed up: "he's talking about abilities and mechanics. That seems scummy."
And your analysis for why Kim is scum can be summed up: "she misremembered one person's position one time."

I don't think you've done any substantive engagement, except to cover yourself. You thrown shade but not backed it up with any real analysis. Can you give me a point-by-point for why Kim or I am scummy?
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Durga » 04 Jul 2019, 21:58

And now you're misrepresentating my position. That's nice. Another point for being scummy.

People need to realize that more content does not equal more analysis.

I'll reiterate myself for your sake this one time. I think it's scummy to rely on made up analysis on who picks what role and then depend on that to scum read people because frankly it's NAI and I get the impression you're struggling to find actual scummy things. And it is definitely weird that Kim totally forgot who said what. I didn't say she was scum, I said that was scummy. I'm unsure at the moment but I didn't like how defensive she was to that one point.

I can say this in these many words, or I can say it in 20000. The point remains the same. Try not to equate my brevity with a lack of analysis because it just isn't true.
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Durga » 04 Jul 2019, 21:59

Just to make it more clear. I'm not saying you're scummy for talking about mechanics, if that was true I'd be scum reading a lot of people. I think it's scummy that you're relying on it to inform your read.
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Aeschines » 04 Jul 2019, 22:02

Also @Fatmo... I do not like that power selection.

I'm not ready to join Nook on his scuMO campaign, but I do not think strength makes a ton of sense as a townie choice.

Question for everyone - am I super off-base with the ability analysis? With Fatmo's reveal, the math doesn't add up the way I was expecting it to.

To me, it seemed like there were pretty clear pro-Scum and Pro-Town abilities with some that were on the margin. I don't want to go on a crusade to burn all the CHA/STR players though because, obviously, we have at least one townie who picked CHA or STR (and sjg who claims to have not picked END). I still think CHA, STR, and END are shady but I realize they math-wise cannot be scum-locks. I'm also assuming Fatmo, Durga, Conq, and Sjg aren't lying about having scum-friendly abilities too, since that would just be irrational.

I'd love some folks to weigh in on this before I get too carried away.

In particular, @Fatmo, how much did you think about STR being a scummy ability before you picked it?
@Durga, can you give me more about why you picked CHA?
@Conq, I think I've heard enough about your selection, but I'd love to get your thoughts on the topic more broadly?
@Kim, did you reveal and I missed it/don't remember?
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Aeschines » 04 Jul 2019, 22:03

Durga wrote:Just to make it more clear. I'm not saying you're scummy for talking about mechanics, if that was true I'd be scum reading a lot of people. I think it's scummy that you're relying on it to inform your read.


I don't think I'm going to be able to invite you to play any of my hidden role games then...
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Fatmo » 04 Jul 2019, 22:06

Conq wrote:
Fatmo wrote:Wait, are you saying that you think if the game gets to 1 v 1 or 2 v 2 that you think the game would continue, even though scum would have already reached parity? Because of the chance of votes being weighed differently? This thought never would have occurred to me. I've asked UFO to clarify. Perhaps I'm not understanding you right here.

Yes. And I did ask UFO to clarify earlier, and he clarified that he will not end the game at parity unless the game is in auto-win, meaning that powers can extend the game.

E.g., a townie with active Charisma can extend the game at 2-2 or ensure that Town wins even at 1-1.


Yea, he just clarified that again with me. If a power like that is actually active on a 1 v 1 or 2 v 2 day and means it won’t be a lock scum win, the day happens.

Conq wrote:
nanooktheeskimo wrote:ScumMo

Pretty sure this is scum fatmo making his debut.

99% sure that Durga making the choices she did is NAI.

Why do you think Fatmo is scum? Are you reacting to an earlier post or the most recent one from Fatmo?


I’d also like an answer to why Nook thinks I’m scum. At some point in many games, Nook seems to get a bit jumpy in thinking I’m in my scum debut. But it strikes me as strange that Nook of all people is calling me scum early D1 here, considering his thoughts about my meta he expressed during D1 of the game we just finished.

So with the lack of explanation here, as well as ideas I’ve seen Nook genuinely have before as town, I’m thinking Nook looks scummier here. He was null for me before. And I often read him pretty well when he’s town. Not gonna vote yet, but that’s where I’m at.

Durga wrote:Why are the two people I throw shade on for being scum both voting me? Smh


I know you’ve said that you didn’t vote Aes just because he voted you. But what are you getting at about Kim? Do you think she’s off in some way that’s more likely to be scummy rather than mistaken townie?

PPE: Ahh, Durga has expanded on this a bit.
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Conq wrote:Fatmo — you are a relentless mountain stream, ever-flowing, slowly but surely carving away at the rock face below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjEgjTfcEJk
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Fatmo » 04 Jul 2019, 22:24

Aes, yea I thought about if strength would be good for scum as well as town. Hell, it’s the one ability that has a different perk for scum. But it’s also potentially good for town too. The way I thought about it, the 1/5 chance I have to get a vig shot at night means there’s a higher chance of town getting that option as opposed to the much more unlikely scenario where scum happens to roll strength and use it on a townie with agility also activated. And I like that strength gives me the option to not even use it if I have it activated but don’t feel confident enough in a scumread to risk taking the shot.

Why did you not even mention the fact that Nook also chose strength? Especially with you going out of your way to say the thought has crossed your mind to join with Nook’s vote on me. I get that you aren’t necessarily scumreading me yet, and say you’re just more suspicious now. But why no suspicion of Nook? Why don’t you think he might be scum with strength and trying to act suspicious of me afraid I might scumread him and try to shoot him if I get a shot? I’d assume this thought would have at least crossed your mind. Like, you did @messages to pretty much half the players, but not the other person to pick the ability you find suspicious I picked?
You don't know what I'm thinking...because I don't know what I'm doing.

Conq wrote:Fatmo — you are a relentless mountain stream, ever-flowing, slowly but surely carving away at the rock face below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jjEgjTfcEJk
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Aeschines » 04 Jul 2019, 22:28

Fatmo wrote:Aes, yea I thought about if strength would be good for scum as well as town. Hell, it’s the one ability that has a different perk for scum. But it’s also potentially good for town too. The way I thought about it, the 1/5 chance I have to get a vig shot at night means there’s a higher chance of town getting that option as opposed to the much more unlikely scenario where scum happens to roll strength and use it on a townie with agility also activated. And I like that strength gives me the option to not even use it if I have it activated but don’t feel confident enough in a scumread to risk taking the shot.

Why did you not even mention the fact that Nook also chose strength? Especially with you going out of your way to say the thought has crossed your mind to join with Nook’s vote on me. I get that you aren’t necessarily scumreading me yet, and say you’re just more suspicious now. But why no suspicion of Nook? Why don’t you think he might be scum with strength and trying to act suspicious of me afraid I might scumread him and try to shoot him if I get a shot? I’d assume this thought would have at least crossed your mind. Like, you did @messages to pretty much half the players, but not the other person to pick the ability you find suspicious I picked?


Ah! I must have missed his reveal!
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Aeschines » 04 Jul 2019, 22:33

I further further agree that Nook also looks bad for taking Strength.

@Nook - why did you take strength? Were your reasons the same as Fatmo listed out above? Were they different?

*On why strength is scummy*
It is a rare case indeed that a vig is beneficial to the town. Either A) they don't kill anyone (in which case it was a waste) or B) they kill someone who *they* think is scum. Occasionally, the town will have weighed in, in advance but in this format the town will never get the chance to know when someone's strength is active. That means that someone (Nook & Fatmo) who took strength believes that they themselves are smart enough to carry the whole town on their back (especially in a 7 player game)... OR they are scum.

I don't know either of them enough to know whether they are the quintessential over-confident dude or not. Do other folks have thoughts on that? Because if they were truly calculating when they chose STR I have a hard time believing they aren't scum.

But, as I said above, I may be overweighting the abilities argument given that my ability-reads (in their starkest terms) leads me to us having 5 scum and 2 town.
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Re: A Very SPECIAL Game Thread of Mafia

Postby Durga » 04 Jul 2019, 22:40

Everyone is scummy for their choices and Aes never has to do a proper analysis again. :)
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