forging communications

Rules for playing on and using the site.
Forum rules
This section of the Forum is for the Site's rules.
If you have a question about how to play the game, please post in the RULES section of the Forum, not here. The site's rules for standard Dip do not substantially differ from published rules.

Re: forging communications

Postby StarWatcher009 » 15 Sep 2017, 01:03

It's a tactic I've often used yet am not too fond of. I believe I have too many moral scruples about this; it should be totally fine.
Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.
User avatar
StarWatcher009
 
Posts: 850
Joined: 26 Dec 2013, 23:43
Location: somewhere
Class: Diplomat
Standard rating: 1021
All-game rating: 1406
Timezone: GMT

Re: forging communications

Postby Machiara » 15 Sep 2017, 01:10

I myself would be extremely unhappy to learn that someone passed my unedited message on to a third party. If I find out you did it, then that pretty much ends our substantive communications right there. I might work with you if I have to but I'm not going to be happy about it.

And if you send someone's message to a third party it is very often that the third party will send the message to that someone as part of their negotiations. Then that person will know that you did it.

Much better to just say "[country X] told me [contents of message]." That way you could be lying or could be telling the truth. It doesn't have the same sort of veracity as passing on the actual text someone sent you.
Personally I'm always ready to learn, although I do not always like being taught.

No idea is so outlandish that it should not be considered with a searching but at the same time a steady eye.

The pessimist sees difficulty in every opportunity. The optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty.
Machiara
 
Posts: 190
Joined: 02 Feb 2016, 19:50
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, California, USA
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (1961)
All-game rating: (1992)
Timezone: GMT-8

Re: forging communications

Postby Don Juan of Austria » 15 Sep 2017, 03:19

A lot gets by in the spirit of the game. 8-) :lol:
"In everything, moderation". ~Aristotle
A proud member of the Whippersnappers,
Bronze Classicists,
Lancer in the PBF cavalry.

Ireland in Heptarchy 16!
Don Juan of Toledo in Diplomacy for Dukes and Popes!
User avatar
Don Juan of Austria
 
Posts: 1210
Joined: 19 Feb 2014, 11:50
Location: South Africa, though given to travel
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: 1047
All-game rating: 1160
Timezone: GMT+2

Re: forging communications

Postby Eleusinian » 15 Sep 2017, 06:17

And just to pile on a bit: if someone forwards me a note from a third party, it makes me wonder whether they'd also send my messages out to other people. So from a tactical perspective, it's something to consider.
Eleusinian
 
Posts: 109
Joined: 27 Mar 2016, 21:38
Class: Ambassador
Standard rating: (984)
All-game rating: (981)
Timezone: GMT

Re: forging communications

Postby gsmx » 15 Sep 2017, 06:48

Eleusinian wrote:And just to pile on a bit: if someone forwards me a note from a third party, it makes me wonder whether they'd also send my messages out to other people. So from a tactical perspective, it's something to consider.

I second this. I rarely would forward a message for this very reason, only exception would be if my alliance is SO tight that we have eliminated any shred of doubt in between each other.
The first quality that is needed is audacity.
User avatar
gsmx
 
Posts: 1469
Joined: 22 Aug 2011, 14:50
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (2097)
All-game rating: (2475)
Timezone: GMT-8

Re: forging communications

Postby gsmx » 15 Sep 2017, 06:49

Eleusinian wrote:And just to pile on a bit: if someone forwards me a note from a third party, it makes me wonder whether they'd also send my messages out to other people. So from a tactical perspective, it's something to consider.

I second this. I rarely would forward a message for this very reason, only exception would be if my alliance is SO tight that we have eliminated any shred of doubt in between each other.

But in terms of legality of it, perfectly fine. Anything thats not against the rules is fair game and this falls under that.
The first quality that is needed is audacity.
User avatar
gsmx
 
Posts: 1469
Joined: 22 Aug 2011, 14:50
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: (2097)
All-game rating: (2475)
Timezone: GMT-8

Re: forging communications

Postby super_dipsy » 15 Sep 2017, 08:19

I have one more thing to add since some reading this thread may not be aware (although I am sure most are).

As has been said, nothing to stop you forwarding edited messages and claiming they were real. I'm not going to enter the 'moral' discussion!

HOWEVER we draw the line at screen shots. The principle we operate is that there needs to be an element of doubt. So you can say X told me this, or you can forward the 'message' X sent you, but the recipient knows you could have just edited it so the information is never definitive. Screen shots are different. Although of course screen shots can be edited eg with PhotoShop, that is not something the average player knows how to do, and therefore a screen shot would to all intents and purpose severely limit that element of doubt.

So you can forward messages, edit and forward them, make claims, but no screen shots.
User avatar
super_dipsy
Premium Member
 
Posts: 12037
Joined: 04 Nov 2009, 17:43
Class: Ambassador
Standard rating: 1000
All-game rating: 941
Timezone: GMT

Re: forging communications

Postby Eleusinian » 15 Sep 2017, 08:50

What about an ASCII art rendition of the screenshot? ;)
Eleusinian
 
Posts: 109
Joined: 27 Mar 2016, 21:38
Class: Ambassador
Standard rating: (984)
All-game rating: (981)
Timezone: GMT

Re: forging communications

Postby DirtyHarry » 15 Sep 2017, 13:07

I agree, big difference between editing and forging. I've only got 10 finished games on the site at this point, but the advice I read was to be very judicious with either practice, and I follow that advice. So far, I've only forged one message, when I was certain the powers weren't talking to each other and I wanted to get them fighting. And then I had another power send the forgery. It worked like a charm, but I was still really sweating it for a "year", worried that the two powers would eventually talk and my forgery would be discovered.

It was really fun to get away with it, but I would say, pick your spots very carefully!
DirtyHarry
Premium Member
 
Posts: 101
Joined: 07 Feb 2017, 22:03
Location: Maryland, USA
Class: Diplomat
Standard rating: 1334
All-game rating: 1349
Timezone: GMT-5

Re: forging communications

Postby Strategus » 15 Sep 2017, 13:38

Machiara wrote:I myself would be extremely unhappy to learn that someone passed my unedited message on to a third party. If I find out you did it, then that pretty much ends our substantive communications right there. I might work with you if I have to but I'm not going to be happy about it.

And if you send someone's message to a third party it is very often that the third party will send the message to that someone as part of their negotiations. Then that person will know that you did it.

Much better to just say "[country X] told me [contents of message]." That way you could be lying or could be telling the truth. It doesn't have the same sort of veracity as passing on the actual text someone sent you.

What if someone sends you a message saying someone had forwarded a false message from you, but the person forwarding it falsified the whole thing? :mrgreen:
The Devil makes work for idle forces

Better to have fought and lost, than never to have fought at all
Actual Platinum Classicist
I did WDC 2017

Just say "NO!" To carebears and kittens
User avatar
Strategus
 
Posts: 1801
Joined: 30 May 2015, 14:30
Location: England
Class: Star Ambassador
Standard rating: 1583
All-game rating: 1730
Timezone: GMT

PreviousNext

Return to Rules for Fair Play and Fair Use

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest