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How to reduce Mexico's power (NO LONGER NEESSARY!)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 19:34
by Pedros
In the AARs to Game 2, I suggested that Mexico starts with a huge advantage - no immediate enemies, and quite a lot of neutral SCs waiting to be grabbed. Others seemed to agree.

It's a pity, because otherwise it's a very good map. diplomat42 (in a note to the Spring 1901 turn) wrote that

So...as I said I'm not a mapmaker, but I think a possible solution to Mexico's power is a Central American power.

and theangrycastle replied:-

If it can be done without weakening Mexico, Spain, or Columbia too much


This could certainly reduce Mexico's advantage considerably, but it would give the already beleagured powers in the Caribbean area another problem to deal with.

Is that the answer?

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 19:36
by Malevolence
simple- add in a CA power but ensure the power has no fleets on the caribbean ocean side.

this way he weakens mexico but the shattered caribbean stays intact more or less.

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 19:48
by diplomat42
@Malevolence: Great idea. Maybe a "Pacific Islands" player or a Native American player whose only option is really to attack Mexico (and a Native American would be at least somewhat accurate...

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 19:56
by Malevolence
try aztecs, or something of the like who did really live in that area.

but yeah, having their only fleet be on the pacific side, and the other units be armies would force mexico to defend his land alot more.

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 20:06
by AardvarkArmy
Hmmm... perhaps bidding on a country with a good starting position is not a bad plan?

While I acknowledge that I had an easy path, that was only partially due to the inherent qualities of the map.

Remember, Mexico was the ONLY country to get only one build in the first year. If USA had not NMR'd and if Mexico's neighbors had aligned to block her, this game would have had a very different outcome...

Hence, I am of the opinion that adding an entirely new opponent would be overkill, and would then make Mexico too weak.

I suggest either 1) tinkering with the supply center distribution (e.g., eliminate hawaii?) or move one of Mexico's neighbors closer (e.g., New Orleans as a starting center for USA)

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 21:03
by rick.leeds
Looking at the map, one of Mexico's advantages is that it is comparatively isolated. Yes, Brazil is, too, but Brazil faces a large number of competitors. I'd look to make Trin neutral, cut Honduras off from the Pacific, take Nic's SC and place it in Hon and make Hon a British starting SC. That may mean shifting Trin's SC somewhere further away from South America.

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 10 Oct 2011, 21:49
by musashisamurai
I wold say eliminate a SC in Central America or move on of Mexic's to California (possibly a fleet)

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 18 Oct 2011, 08:27
by theangrycastle
I think doing something that would give someone else a reason to compete with Mexico early on would be a good idea. Maybe give spain a center in Central America?

Nicaragua?

PostPosted: 09 Jan 2013, 18:57
by Pedros
This thread has been dormant for a couple of years, but when War in the Americas was played here (twice) it was extremely popular. But it suffers from a big balance problem - Mexico has too much space to expand and was dominant in both games; and the central powers - especially Spain, in the Caribbean - were very weak.

The starting map is reproduced below (although in the original, California is an additional supply centre, which would actually strengthen Mexico's position even further!) If rick.leeds' suggestion were to be adopted - giving Spain a base on the mainland - Nicaragua would be the obvious place. It would provide immediate competition for Mexico at the start, give Spain both more power and more options, and present new opportunities for alliances. The possible downside is further weakening the northern states in South America - Colombia and Venezuela - and the game would need to be tested in a form like this. But comments from the map experts would be welcome.

Image

Re: How to reduce Mexico's power (War in the Americas)

PostPosted: 12 Jan 2013, 06:06
by Pedros
I've taken a good look at Mexico's position. It seems to me that Mex isn't especially blessed by available neutral supply centres (although California and Alaska are almost certain gains in years 2 and 3). The real problem is lack of competition. Rick commented that Brazil is isolated also. Quite apart from the fact that that isn't much consolation to the other South American nations (slogging it out amongst themselves at close quarters and with very limited opportunities) and also to USA/UK in Canada, Brazil isn't as isolated as Mexico. Granted USA can take Texas immediately (although holding it in the Fall isn't guaranteed), USA seems to have its work cut out to hold off Canadian advances - in game 2 USA felt the need to withdraw completely from Texas New Orleans after year one.

There was one other big advantage given to Mexico in these two games which may have made a very big difference: both were played "Build Anywhere". This gives a huge aedvantage to the player growing and going forward, and on a map as large as this one may be critical. I think it will be worth playing this game again as Home Builds Only.